Traveller-digest       Tuesday, August 3 1999       Volume 1999 : Number 914



(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.
All rights reserved.

The following topics are covered in this digest:

Re: Book Reviews Requested
Re: Real life Flywheel Energy stores (AKA HPGs)
Re: Book Reviews Requested
[none]
Re: RL:There's Oil in them thar Saturnian satellites...
Re: Ground To Space Laser Fire....
Re: Ground To Space Laser Fire....
Re: Spacedocks
Re: World Builder Deluxe Answers
Titan inTraveller
Re: Icelandic Babelfish?
Re: RL:There's Oil in them thar Saturnian satellites...
Re: RL:There's Oil in them thar Saturnian satellites...
OT-Crusade
Re: Millenial Project
Re: Millenial Project 
Re: Millenial Project 
RE: Test
RE: Spacecreaft Combat ratings questions
RE: Republishing CT materials 
Re: Republishing CT materials
Re: Book Reviews Requested
Re: Ground To Space Laser Fire....
FW: Test

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 15:25:38 -0700 (PDT)
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com>
Subject: Re: Book Reviews Requested

Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella writes:

> Well, I guess I can stand American units, however, do they use miles for
> steller scale measurements like orbital zones, etc.?  Or do they use light
> secs, mins, AUs etc.? Speaking of which, is there any unit of measurement
> that is *not* Sol-centric? As I understand, even parsecs are calculated by
> Terra's orbit, right? Just curious...

They use AU for planetary orbits, miles for lunar orbits.  There's no common unit of measurement which isn't human-centric, though lots of measures aren't sol-centric per se (neither the foot nor the meter has anything to do with the sun).

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 18:09:59 +0100
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com>
Subject: Re: Real life Flywheel Energy stores (AKA HPGs)

"Robert O'Connor" <robocon@ozemail.com.au> writes:

>Dom Mooney wrote :-
>> Gearhead challenge: Why is the flycylinder arrangement inherently more safe
>> than the flywheel (disk arrangement)?
>>
>My Cr 0.02...
>
>The flycylinder is equivalent to a group of flywheels with a small
>radius. So I'd go with smaller moments of inertia and a reduced torque
>requirement to stop the thing in event of a problem.

Good point, but not the one I'm after ;-)

shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca (Steven Hudson) writes:

>  For a given energy storage requirement the unit will be more
>structurally reliable? (i.e., does the cylinders greater single
>volume provide more cohesion if a flaw exists or develops?)

Bear in mind the cylinders are usually laid up by being glass/carbon
filament wound into a resin. Almost inevitably you will get a filament
bobbin running out of thread. The only real problems occur if a fibre
projects through the resin surface and can act as a stress concentrator.

What causes failure?

1) offgassing instability - instability and out of balance forces.
2) Overspeed - material bursts due to forces.
3) material/structural defect (see above)

Also - bearing or vacuum pump failure, or miscalculation of clearances
which change due to speed increase. Resonance modes.

The key to the performance of the cylinder is in its geometry...

Now, shall I tell you the answer I was after, or do you want another go? ;-)

Dom

- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------
"In the End I found beginnings, not a vision, a wake up call.
Raised from the dead by a beating heart and at last I can
  see it all. And my eyes were opened to the darkness.."
                  Fish /Raingods with Zippos/
Rob Prior's Mac software @ http://www.bits.org.uk/ 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 18:00:31 +0100
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com>
Subject: Re: Book Reviews Requested

"Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com> writes:

>I was looking through the web catalogs for what I might buy next, and T4
>Central Supply Catalog really caught my eye. So did the Alien Archive,
>regardless of its Newt infestation. I am, as previously noted, highly CT
>oriented, but open-minded too (I hope ;) ), and was wondering if any one had
>any strong opinions here.

CSC has almost every piece of equipment ever described in Traveller (as
published by GDW). The vehicle design system is workable, but not the same
as FFS2. I use it, along with Emperor's Arsenal and the T4 book with Marc's
Playtest t4.x/T5 material as my core rules. I also use High Guard but
that's another story.

The Alien Archive is good, and has plenty of scope for use as background
material, but suffers from being padded by increasing the text size to fill
the book.

Of the two, both are useable for CT, but I personally would buy CSC first
as it has more utility.

>Additionally, when T5 comes out, what books out
>now are likely to not be covered in that material and/or highly compliments
>it? I like what I here about T5, so I'll be avoiding core rule stuff till
>then as I have enough CT to get by there.

Why not email Marc Miller and ask if you can get a copy of the playtest
draft? From what I've seen of it provided he doesn't alter combat too much
a lot of the T4 stuff will be useable.

>Still debating between World
>Builders Handbook and First In, opinions there?

WBH, but First In is really nice too.

Dom

- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------
"In the End I found beginnings, not a vision, a wake up call.
Raised from the dead by a beating heart and at last I can
  see it all. And my eyes were opened to the darkness.."
                  Fish /Raingods with Zippos/
Rob Prior's Mac software @ http://www.bits.org.uk/ 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 23:38:42 +0100
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com>
Subject: [none]

Adding to the recent spacedock debate:

In the B5 film 'A Call to Arms' the two Destroyers are built off a lattice
framed spacedock not a million miles in concept from the one in the early
Star Trek film. This looks much more credible than the ST Enclosed
Spacedock.

Dom

OT-PS Is 'A Call to Arms' the pilot for Crusade? Or is there another pilot?


- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------
"In the End I found beginnings, not a vision, a wake up call.
Raised from the dead by a beating heart and at last I can
  see it all. And my eyes were opened to the darkness.."
                  Fish /Raingods with Zippos/
Rob Prior's Mac software @ http://www.bits.org.uk/ 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 16:14:02 -0700
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: RL:There's Oil in them thar Saturnian satellites...

>If this doesn't get our lazy butts into space, I don't know what will...

>http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/sci/tech/newsid_406000/406859.stm
>
>"The best images ever taken of Saturn's
>mysterious moon Titan reveals a complex surface
>that may be home to icy landforms and frigid
>hydrocarbon seas."
>Not only that it quotes our very own sensors guru, Bruce Macintosh: (I'm
>presuming it's him...how many of 'em could there be?)
I come in six-packs.
(Yes, this was me; this is what I do in my real life.)

>"The dark material could be a sea of liquid
>methane, ethane or other hydrocarbons,"
>Livermore's Bruce Macintosh said. "It's one of the
>darkest things in the solar system. It could also be
>solid organic material."

Note that the BBC doesn't seem to know the difference between
"ethane", "hydrocarbons", and "oil"; the "seas" would be liquid ethane/methane
mixture. (Liquid natural gas, I suppose), not oil.

I'm actually fairly proud of the result. The most interesting aspect is that
on Titan
one seems to have organic molecules (methane) getting broken down by UV
light and reassembling into other molecules (ethane, acetalyne, maybe solid
tholens) - kind of like chemistry on the pre-biotic earth. One could get some
quite
exotic organic compounds occuring. In some ways, Titan is the most earthlike
place in the solar system right now...

(Though personally I don't think it's likely to have life.)

Bruce

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 16:18:48 -0700
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Ground To Space Laser Fire....

>Question...  would a 100Mw chemically-pumped laser, if fired from
>the ground be sufficient to incinerate something the size of the Hubble?
>Say firing time is in the 3 to 6 second range.  Or would the energy level
>have to be higher?  Doing a reality-check on a game situation and was
>wondering.  Thanks.

Not vapourize - 100 MW isn't that much power. Badly mess up, certainly,
depending on how concentrated the beam is.

Bruce

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1999 00:13:33 +0100
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Ground To Space Laser Fire....

>Ok, so lots of very short pulses or fewer longer ones, but I still
>reckon that just turning the laser on for 3 seconds won't work
>against the sort of armour and radiator tech that Trav uses (although
>even this should make the Hubble very unhappy).


Well, a few seconds of MIRACL was enough to frag that USAF recon sat (that,
incidentally, the USAF wasn't entirely sure it was finished with). But that
was, as you say, a soft kill.

In Trav, the armour and active defences are a lot heavier, but then the
lasers themselves have been uprated from the 1-MW range to several hundred
times as large.


>Hmmm, do I detect a basis for the 50MW*TL limit for lasers handwave in T4?


I think you found the basis for the convincing handwave. I think the actual
reason is to prevent ships like the Beacon Heavy SDB (2000 Mj superheavy
lasers).....

NB

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1999 00:16:41 +0100
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Spacedocks

>In the B5 film 'A Call to Arms' the two Destroyers are built off a lattice
>framed spacedock not a million miles in concept from the one in the early
>Star Trek film. This looks much more credible than the ST Enclosed
>Spacedock.


Well, the enclosed spacedock does beg the question: "What did they build the
dock in?"

<gd+r>

Nick

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 00:13:41 +0100
From: Mark Watson <markw@antares.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: World Builder Deluxe Answers

On Mon, 02 Aug 1999, you wrote:
>WBD uses MT system generation rules. If a gas giant is present in the
>habitable zone of a system then the mainworld becomes a satellite of that
>gas giant. I was quite surprised myself to find out just how frequently this
>happened.
>
Coincidentally this recently discovered extrasolar planet looks like a gas
giant which crosses the "habitable" zone of its star:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/sci/tech/newsid_407000/407772.stm

- --
Mark Watson, markw@antares.demon.co.uk

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 16:28:40 -0700
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Titan inTraveller

I'm in the middle of an observing run, so I don't have buckets of time, but
here's
the quick Traveller stat:

Titan: X3A4000-0

(I can't quite decide between poisonous and corrosive atmosphere - it's mostly
nitrogen, so an oxygen mask would suffice, except that it's only 90 K or so,
and the hydrocarbon gunk would probably sting exposed skin.)

(Of course, with most Traveller rules it's impossible to actually generate
this...)

The atmosphere is 90-99% opaque to visible light; the surface will be dingy -
like moonlit earth at best. Visibility is probably less than a mile for human
eyes.
Over much of the surface, a continuous mist of liquid ethane rains down.
Speculatively, one might have "snow" of solid organic tholens, possibly
associated
with tropospheric clouds. The "seas" are black.

Heavily non-earthlike worlds like this are kind of rare in Traveller
campaigns,
which makes sense - with jump drive, you can afford to be picky - but kind
of sad, too.

Traveller: Titan is actually kind of mysterious in the real world.
Calculations
show that the methane in its atmosphere should all be converted into ethane in
10^7 years or so, A methane "ocean" might supply a reservoir to replenish it,
but the "seas" we see aren't big enough for this (radar results reinforce this
conclusion.) Also, Titan's orbit is slightly eccentric - more eccentric than
it should
be; tides from Saturn should circularize the orbit in 10^8-10^9 years.
So (in Traveller), perhaps the atmosphere is a recent artifact - possibly
Titan
was the site of a primary base for the Ancients surveillance of Earth
project...
so it attracted a massive bombardment by 0.1-c comets, sufficient to
generate the current methane atmosphere and knock it into a less eccentric
orbit. Other evidence for this includes the "death star" crater on another
Saturnian moon, and a third moon that is half-covered with black soot...
(Note to the credulous: the above paragraph is pure science fiction. Hopefully
the BBC will never get ahold of it.)

Bruce

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 23:51:18 +0100
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com>
Subject: Re: Icelandic Babelfish?

"Paul Schirf" <Paul@Schirf.com> writes:
>Gەur r af Verslun Class
>1000 Ton Swordworlder Frontier Merchant (Erlendur Markaur)

Under MacOS the 6th character of Markau is an Apple logo ;-)

Dom

- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------
"In the End I found beginnings, not a vision, a wake up call.
Raised from the dead by a beating heart and at last I can
  see it all. And my eyes were opened to the darkness.."
                  Fish /Raingods with Zippos/
Rob Prior's Mac software @ http://www.bits.org.uk/ 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 16:46:42 -0700
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu>
Subject: Re: RL:There's Oil in them thar Saturnian satellites...

Bruce Macintosh wrote:

> Note that the BBC doesn't seem to know the difference between
> "ethane", "hydrocarbons", and "oil"; the "seas" would be liquid ethane/methane
> mixture. (Liquid natural gas, I suppose), not oil.

All told, though, an easily transportable petrochemical feedstock...once
a _little_ infrastructure gets built it should be cheaper to drop it in
system from Titan than boosting it up from Earth, to just about
anywhere. All you really need is a big tank and some relatively small
rockets. If they're unmanned, you don't really care if they take a long
time to get there.
 
> I'm actually fairly proud of the result. The most interesting aspect is that
> on Titan
> one seems to have organic molecules (methane) getting broken down by UV
> light and reassembling into other molecules (ethane, acetalyne, maybe solid
> tholens) 

twice now you've mentioned 'tholens'... maybe I was sleeping that day in
organic chem, but I've never heard  the term...what are they?

- -- 
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 17:17:37 -0700 (PDT)
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com>
Subject: Re: RL:There's Oil in them thar Saturnian satellites...

Bruce Johnson writes:
> All told, though, an easily transportable petrochemical feedstock...once
> a _little_ infrastructure gets built it should be cheaper to drop it in
> system from Titan than boosting it up from Earth, to just about
> anywhere. All you really need is a big tank and some relatively small
> rockets. If they're unmanned, you don't really care if they take a long
> time to get there.

Heh.  Including braking, I'm not convinced.  Delta-V from saturn to mars (via hohmann transfer orbit) is about 11 kps total, delta-V from earth to mars is only about 6 kps.  However, this isn't counting in effects such as slingshot manuevers, and the cost of escaping orbit, or the fact that solar panels are more effective near earth, so I'm not sure which would really be cheaper...

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 21:44:33 -0400
From: "Keven R. Pittsinger" <jamstar@accesstoledo.com>
Subject: OT-Crusade

> In the B5 film 'A Call to Arms' the two Destroyers are built off a lattice
> framed spacedock not a million miles in concept from the one in the early
> Star Trek film. This looks much more credible than the ST Enclosed
> Spacedock.
> 
> OT-PS Is 'A Call to Arms' the pilot for Crusade? Or is there another pilot?

Yup, it's the leadin for the series.

Keven

- -- 
tc++ tm+ tn t4- to ru++ ge+ 3i c+ jt au st- ls pi+ ta+ he+ so- vi zh sy
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                                     Science-Fiction Adventure
                                                     In Reavers' Deep

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 01:34:52 GMT
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)
Subject: Re: Millenial Project

The Millenial Project's web site is (I believe) www.millenial.com
Last I checked they were going pretty well but it has been awhile.

On Mon, 02 Aug 1999 21:24:15 +0200, you wrote:

>Hi all,
>some while ago, someone on this list recommended the book
>"The Millenial Project" by Marshall T Savage. I forgot who, though.
>
>Anyway I ordered the book, received it last week and all I can say is "wow"!
>It describes a possible (?) way for humanity to go about seeding the stars
>and 
>fulfilling its destiny.
>
>Having come a quarter of he way (through the book) now, I started to wonder
>what parts 
>have been proven wrong, if the Millenial Foundation still exists and how
>far they have come
>till now. I distantly remember someone said he was a member, so maybe you
>could enlighten us?
>
>Thanks, 
>Volker
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>Volker A. Greimann --- http://www.greimann.de --- volker@greimann.de
>

================================================================================
- - Pete                                                      j_pete@bellsouth.net

"Every citizen [should] be a soldier. This was the case with the Greeks and  the
 Romans, and must be that of every free state."   -Thomas Jefferson

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 22:40:50 -0400
From: "Keven R. Pittsinger" <jamstar@accesstoledo.com>
Subject: Re: Millenial Project 

> The Millenial Project's web site is (I believe) www.millenial.com
> Last I checked they were going pretty well but it has been awhile.

All I find there are a couple 'holder pages' telling me the domain(s) are
reserved.

Keven

- -- 
tc++ tm+ tn t4- to ru++ ge+ 3i c+ jt au st- ls pi+ ta+ he+ so- vi zh sy
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                                     Science-Fiction Adventure
                                                     In Reavers' Deep

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 01:50:56 GMT
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)
Subject: Re: Millenial Project 

Whoops! Sorry about that! The web site USED to be www.millenial.org. I
just checked and found out that the First Millennial Foundation has
become the Living Universe Foundation and that web site is www.luf.org


On Mon, 02 Aug 1999 22:40:50 -0400, you wrote:

>> The Millenial Project's web site is (I believe) www.millenial.com
>> Last I checked they were going pretty well but it has been awhile.
>
>All I find there are a couple 'holder pages' telling me the domain(s) are reserved.
>
>Keven

================================================================================
- - Pete                                                      j_pete@bellsouth.net

"Every citizen [should] be a soldier. This was the case with the Greeks and  the
 Romans, and must be that of every free state."   -Thomas Jefferson

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 20:47:07 -0700
From: "Jesse DeGraff" <fenris@slip.net>
Subject: RE: Test

got it bro'
Jesse



> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of
> igor@truserve.com
> Sent: Monday, August 02, 1999 10:42 AM
> To: traveller@mpgn.com
> Subject: Test
> 
> 
> Sorry for this...but my posts don't seem to be making this, so 
> I'm testing if anyone 
> sees this...
> 
> Andy
> 
> 
> 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 13:33:34 +1000
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au>
Subject: RE: Spacecreaft Combat ratings questions

> From: Thad Coons 

>   Hmm. A tortuous chain of reasoning gave me an estimated average
> of 1 "major" combatant (over 1000 dtons), and 3 "minor"
> combatants (under 1000 dtons) per squadron. IS says a
> billion credits buys a "small" squadron of 100-300 dton ships or
> maybe one battle cruiser, which fits roughly with your 2-4 ships,
> and with the thousands of SDB squadrons allowed for a high
> population world. I haven't designed or even used any SDBs, so I
> don't know. I'm not familiar with Air force structure: How many
> craft are typically in a squadron, and how many squadrons in a
> wing?

There are descriptions of Milieu 1100 IN squadrons in a couple of places. 
They tend to have about 8 or so major combatants, or a single tender and a
bunch of battleriders, all _well_ over the 1000 ton mark, plus about as
many escorts, also over 1000 tons.  This is the kind of squadron that
ballparks to around a trillion credits.  

Actual squadrons designed for play in TCS tend to be rather different, of
course, since they tend to be optimised for the sole purpose of killing
other TCS squadrons, and don't have to operate in the "real" world.

The kind of "battle cruiser" that can be designed for a billion credits is
something like the good old Kinunir class - not a battle cruiser in any
serious sense of the term, unless you are operating in an arbitrarily
tonnage limited environment (and such environments can be fun,
incidentally).

May I suggest you check out your ship design rules, and see what you can
churn out for various amounts of cash.  The other thing to do would be to
check out the various gearhead pages, and see what kind of ships they have
for various systems.  This would give you a feel for what is possible, and
then you can work out what you want.

Of course, the real fudge factors are the ones that give the answers _you_
want.  The squadrons I described above are just the ones from the books -
the ones in your game are the ones you want in your game.

Oh, and as for how many SDBs you can build for a billion credits:  well,
none of the figures people have posted change the basics of my original
argument - they're still in the same order of magnitude. 

Alan Bradley
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 21:17:35 -0700
From: "Jesse DeGraff" <fenris@slip.net>
Subject: RE: Republishing CT materials 

I aim....er, Ditzie aims to please :)
Jesse





> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Sword
> Worlder
> Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 1999 6:44 PM
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com
> Subject: Re: Republishing CT materials 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: Keven R. Pittsinger <jamstar@accesstoledo.com>
> > >     Volker, who ever it was that we turned our FGMP-15s on.
> > 
> > So who do we owe the medal to for whacking out Clif?
> 
> Ditzie.  There is a nice little drawing on Jesse's site.  SMOkin'! :->
> 
> 
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> The TRAVELLER Domain
> http://www.downport.com
> Colin Michael, Webslinger
> 
> 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 23:37:57 -0500
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net>
Subject: Re: Republishing CT materials

Jesse DeGraff wrote:
> 
> I aim....er, Ditzie aims to please :)

Yes, of course.  "Ms. Spofulam, aim, please..._not_ this way, if you
don't mind....
"Aiming at Clif?  What a _capital_ idea!  No sentients to be harmed down
_that_ range...."  >;-)

- -- 
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 03 Aug 99 00:44:40 -0500
From: "Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net>
Subject: Re: Book Reviews Requested

On 08/02/99 at 11:37 AM,  "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com> said:

>> I haven't seen First In, but I am very happy with World Builders Handbook.

>I haven't seen either, I have a three mile driveway and live over an
>hours drive from the nearest hobby store. Despite the name, does the
>WBH cover system generation too? First In seems to cover orbital
>dynamics, steller types, etc., all things I would like. But maybe WBH
>does too? BZA

I have all three.  The shortest way to put it is...

First In = B6+WBH.

For complete system creation you need Book 6 for the system down to
the UWP level and WBH for the physical, cultural and technological
details.  First In gives you both in one book, *but* with a GURPS
spin.  

At this point, I still like B6+WBH better than First In, but that's
because I'm more familar with the older books...and the spreadsheet
I use is based off them.  If you can get B6 and WBH right now, get
them! Your chance may not come again. ;->

First In is very good, it's more commonly available, and probably
less expensive in today's market.  I don't think you'd be
disappointed with First In if you get it instead.

Now, about the other two books you mentioned.  

I liked CSC a lot when I got it, and although some things in it
frustrate me, I still do.  The armor system doesn't match any of the
other Traveller rules, neither FFS, Striker or MT, and it doesn't
handle layered armor, that's all that really breaks it.  Fusion+
seems to be T4 specific...and non-Marc approved at that.  The
computer rules included are very interesting, but aren't *used*
anywhere else.  However, given all that it's worth having and using
for small vehicles.

Alien Archives has sat on my shelf unopened since the week after I
bought it.  I read it and put it on the shelf.  I didn't *hate* it,
I didn't love it, and I haven't used it.  If I were you, I'd pass it
by.

Eris
- -- 
- -----------------------------------------------------------
"Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net>    using MR/2 ICE #245
- -----------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 03 Aug 99 00:49:51 -0500
From: "Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net>
Subject: Re: Ground To Space Laser Fire....

On 08/02/99 at 07:55 PM,  Phil Kitching <postmark.design@btinternet.com> said:


>Hmmm, do I detect a basis for the 50MW*TL limit for lasers handwave
>in T4?

Not just T4. ;-> The 50MW*TL rule came from  "discussions" on this and the Tech list during the TNE days...IIRC.

Eris
- -- 
- -----------------------------------------------------------
"Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net>    using MR/2 ICE #245
- -----------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 17:20:18 +0800
From: "Antony Farrell" <Skaran@bigpond.com>
Subject: FW: Test

- -----Original Message-----
From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com
[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com] On Behalf Of Nick
Bradbeer
Sent: Tuesday, 3 August 1999 2:02
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com
Subject: Re: Test




>Sorry for this...but my posts don't seem to be making this, so I'm testing
if anyone
>sees this...


You're alive.

NB

Or a reasonable facimile of!
AF

------------------------------

End of Traveller-digest V1999 #914
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